Let's talk about the pink elephant in the room... the JKR vs Steve Vander Ark thing

[Zoan06]

I noticed that no one has talked about this yet, so I will bring it up.

I'm not going to get into the facts, since I will screw it all up. I do however, urge you to read this post about the whole situation:

http://praetorianguard.livejournal.com/270707.html

It was written by a lawyer who specializes in such things, and explained in a way that everyone can easily understand.

I will say that after reading the facts, I am firmly on JKR's side of this. The man has no right to publish any of this, especially when JKR flat out told him no.

That being said, myself and a few of my friends are very weary about the fact that SVA will be opening and closing Portus. We are of the opinion that he should be uninvited as a guest. He is not someone I want to represent me or my friends at the con. He is trying to exploit JKR's material for his own personal gain. So I've set up a nice poll to see who supports this view and who is against it, and to start MEANINGFUL dialog about the whole thing.

This doesn't mean I will not come to Portus if he does remain part of it. I will simply enjoy Portus and not attend the Welcoming or Leaving Feasts. If I see him, I will walk the other way. I don't like the man, and I don't want to have anything to do with him. But that will NOT stop me from enjoying myself.

That is my two cents on the issue. Now, let's hear yours. :)

[kneazlecat54]

I haven't read the post to which you referred yet, but I will. Nevertheless, I wanted to respond to this.

Having been to law school myself (although not ever having practiced), I can tell you that the most valuable lesson I learned there is that there are just about always 2 sides to every story. We simply don't know how this all transpired, and the information we've gotten has been, naturally enough, presented so as to favor the presenter. So I'm urging everyone to suspend their judgments on this very unpleasant and sad situation.

It appears to me that each side has right and wrongs associated with it. And I have no doubt whatsoever that the real movers here are WB and Steve's publishers, both of whom are seeing this as a money-making opportunity. I think that WB has been disgustingly rapacious from the beginning, and I doubt that Jo knew what she was getting into when she signed with them. They have people whose entire job it is to make sure that no one is doing what they consider to be infringing on their copyright-in other words, people who are the legal equivalent of hitmen. I find this to be a repugnant activity that chills creativity and expression in regard to literary works. WB is the reason (as I understand it) why we can't call the security volunteers at the cons "aurors" or use any JKR-invented terminology in the PR pieces about the cons. Given that the cons are run by nonprofit 501 (c)
(3) educational entities, there's no question of anyone trying to steal money from WB. Their attitude on this is just belligerent, it seems to me.

On the other hand, Steve's publishers are way out of line trying to make this a 1st Amendment problem. Freedom of speech doesn't mean you get to say or do anything you want any time you want. This outfit looks to me like some 3rd rate publishing house (look at their list, for Pete's sake) that thinks it's going to cash in with this book. They're deluding themselves about that. The audience for this book would not be anything like the number of people who buy canon. It would just be hard-core fans, and not all of those.

I just can't believe that there isn't some amicable solution to this. I think that if Steve and Jo sat down together and talked about it, they could work something out. I think Jo should stand up to WB and tell them to back off of some of their outrageously greedy behavior. I think Steve would be gracious and wise to defer to Jo's wishes on this book, even though I believe he has the right under fair use to publish it (just as many other people have published explanatory books on canon). I think Steve should look for a more professional publisher.

Clearly canon is the writing that is dearest to our hearts. But the Lexicon is brilliant and invaluable, as Jo has said explicitly and implicitly. As someone once said, "Differences...are nothing at all if our aims are identical and our hearts are open." If people don't want to attend Steve's talks, they need not do so, but we are not parties to this disagreement and I suggest that our best stance is neutrality. We're a fandom. Let's stay united and root for a happy resolution.

Peace.

Laura

[dramaqueen872005]

I don't really know/understand what this is all about, I've been a little MIA lately concerning the news of the HP world.

I know that SVA is creator of the HP Lexicon. I don't know what this book thing is about, and to be honest, I don't care. As long as nothing happens to the Lexicon.

I know JKR owns HP and all that, but lately it seems she's going suit-crazy, like with the Hogwarts replica in India. I understand where she's coming from, but it's starting to get annoying.

As far as SVA speaking at Portus- why not? I'd love to see him speak.

Sorry if I'm being ignorant.

[Ravenheart]

They say money is the root of all evil. Well I don't know about all that but it sure can make normal or even abinormal people become strange and sad and turn even the most noble endever become something icky!

[Forge]

Whatever comes of this lawsuit is for the courts to decide. There is, of course, the court of public opion and we could sit here for days going back and forth. I don't personally know Steve Vander Ark but I do know that he is an important part of the fandom and he is a wonderful speaker. I saw him at Prophecy (rather reluctantly as, to be quite honest, he seemed a little full of himself and I didn't want to get screamed out by fangirls) and was delighted to find how much I enjoyed his presentation.

If anyone is of the opinion that they do not wish to have anything to do with Mr. Vander Ark, a very easy solution exists. Simply don't attend any of his presentations. But to go so far as to say that he should be disinvited due to certain people's personal opinions and deny all other attendees the chance to experience him is akin to removing books from libraries because certain people don't agree with subject matter and therefore feel that they have the right to make that decision on behalf of everyone.

[Hedwig]

I tend to believe that, while on the surface publishing the Lexicon seems odd, the courts will decide that. I have seen some posts elsewhere on this (yes, fandom you keep Fandom Wankers beyond happy), not just the one from the head of Terminus, and sometimes it has to do more with personal feelings toward Vander Ark than a real reading of the case. I think there are merits on both sides, but I also think that, in the end, JKR controls the rights to her works and his use of it here seems to violate those. I am also not sure how each type of event like this by WB leads further down to road to stepping on other toes as well. Before I'll jump on the "Yay JKR and WB" bandwagon I might want to see how this would set a precedent for future legal actions on what we consider 'legal' activities currently.

That being said, his participation at Portus, or any future HP event, shouldn't be contigent on what a few fans 'feel' about his actions here. Certainly there are members of the community who will go out of their way to make their feelings known (ad naseum and everywhere they can because of their personal feelings and other 'motives' ;) ), but I think there are valid points for both he and JKR and, despite the learned legal skills put forth in the link, I think there are some missing elements not covered there as well.

All that being said, anyone can choose to not go to Steve's talks and still have a great time at Portus. I can't see how this would change anyone's mind about attending his talks, they're quite clever and he is a great speaker...and it's not like he killed JKR's cat. :D

[DreamCastle]

I, also, am a little ignorant of these court hearings, etc. I do know that SVA seems like an intelligent person capable of holding an interesting lecture/learning session. I support JK's rights and ownerships, she DID create this world, after all. HOWEVER she needs to get back to why she wrote it in the first place. She wanted to share this w/ ppl, entertain, bring back a love of books; etc. She has made reportedly a billion dollars. She wants to sue b/c a fan wants to put out something to ADD on to her works. She has made enough money from it, I should think. WB has made enough money, too. I know I know...what's enough money? But they HAVE! Pretty soon, they're going to sue everyone that wants to hold a HP con b/c of some bs about paying for the event and showing the films and it could be said that you're paying to watch the films and getting paid for ppl to dress as HER characters and use HER terminology blahblahblah. U see where I'm going w/ this? It will never end if greed is allowed to run amok.
RAVENHEART: LOVE of money is the root of all evil. Not money itself. The love of it has to be there. That's what this is all about.
I seriously didn't mean this to be this long. All of this being said, I don't think SVA should try to publish something so obviously infringing on JK's works. I don't dislike him b/c of it. And I don't support the uber-suing-ness (totatlly not a word) of WB and JK about lesser issues.

[TheSilverDoe]

I honestly don't know what to think about this issue. I've always liked Steve Vander Ark. He's got a great website, he's intelligent, and it's always very interesting to listen to him on Pottercast.

It's a shame that this whole lawsuit came about. I'm probably not educated enough on the matter to make a great judgment, but I can at least have an opinion. I don't think Steve ever expected this to happen- I'm sure that anything the Lexicon might publish will in no possible way live up to what JK Rowling will write. After all, we expect new information from her that the Lexicon can't possibly know about. When this whole thing came about I'm sure it's only natural that his first instinct would be to protect his work and everything he's done for this project.

I still think Steve will be a great speaker. He knows so much about Harry and the fandom, and I look forward to him speaking.

[Seeringrose]

I have been keeping up on this issue itself, and have several opinions, all of which I shall keep precise. However knowing me, it will turn into a rant.

Steve isn't the one being the arse, RDR is. They are creating a flurry of stupid, what with a page the just keep updating (despite legal advice, and common sense telling them, that when you are being sued, the first thing you should do is shut up), references to Hiroshima, and bringing in a cousin to help them with the court hearing.

And what the whole issue is this book, as far as RDR's continuous mentioning of it and the responses they have (reportedly) directed toward WB, is ALL cannon, none of the editorials, theories, or speculations that the other books had. Therefore with no new material, it can't be published.
On another note, RDR’s main defense strategy appears to be, since Jo allowed (didn’t sue) the Lexicon to be up online, she should react no differently to it being in book form. Not only does this defense not take into account the profit of the book, if by some freak of nature rule in favor of RDR, we may see the end of online fandom, with all authors/creators/and whatnot suing all websites to be taken down, so they can’t print books. (I realize I am melodramatic, and I am sorry)


I do think Steve should be allowed to attend by all means, he should also be able to hold as many presentations (within reason) as he wants, however I would like to have his opening and closing portus, to be put on probation for two reasons. The first is yeah, this is a pretty big blemish on his reputation, and it may affect people’s opinions of him later on, once this thing is in court. The second would actually be for his own good. Terminus has actually added him to their showcase, during the whole ordeal. That more then likely will come up to bite someone’s ass in court. I think suspending him temporarily, while he is in court with this whole thing, would in the long run be a better choice for Steve.

[lupintonks85]

SVA is a wonderful speaker and knows his Harry Potter. I would be upset if he was asked not to attend. I am looking forward to hearing him speak.

[opaleyes]

To quote JK Rowling (bolding by me):

"I am very frustrated that a former fan has tried to co-opt my work for financial gain. The Harry Potter books are full of moral choices and ethical dilemmas, and, ironically, Mr. Vander Ark's actions tend to demonstrate that he is woefully unfit to represent himself as a 'fan of' or 'expert on' books whose spirit he seems entirely to have missed."

“Such a position penalizes copyright owners like me for encouraging and supporting the activities of their respective fan communities. If RDR’s position is accepted, it will undoubtedly have a significant, negative impact on the freedoms enjoyed by genuine fans on the internet. Authors everywhere will be forced to protect their creations much more rigorously, which could mean denying well-meaning fans permission to pursue legitimate creative activities.”

"...I have excellent relations with many members of the fan community, I find it devastating to contemplate the possibility of such a severe alteration of author-fan relations. I continue to believe that the online fandom has been a wonderful experience for thousands of people, myself included; that it has become, not only an enormous global book club, but engendered an explosion of creativity and communication rooted in a world we would all like to inhabit.”


That totally sums it up for me.

Source is a PDF:
http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/docs/rowlingfeb27.pdf

[opaleyes]

http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/2008/4/15/first-day-of-jkr-wb-vs-rdr-books-trial

[TheSilverDoe]

Personally, I think it's a shame that everyone is completely bashing Steve over this. The way I see it is that he didn't think it would be a big deal when he decided to publish the lexicon (who would've? I would never have guessed that JKR wouldn't want it published, but of course that is completely her right). So when problems came about I have a feeling RDR really pushed him around and told what to do/say. Because there's no doubt that Steve is a true HP fan, and no fan would want to upset JKR.

Yes, he had bad judgment and he made a mistake, but I really don't think it should be held against him like some people are. In my opinion The Lexicon is still one of the greatest HP sites out there and I'm still proud of Steve for creating it in the first place.

[Miss Freewind]

I am not giving my opinion on the lawsuit but I think that since Steve has already been allowed to participate in the Opening and Closing Ceremonies by the heads of the conference that it should be his decision if he would still like to. I think it would look really bad if the conference barred him from doing so because a lot people still think he is a important part of the fandom.

[David]

I'm not going to go into as much detail as I could, because it upsets me too much, but I don't think Portus itself should do anything. It's up to him.

Personally if I was him I wouldn't want to do it anymore, because he won't get a good reception, but it's his choice.

As for the issue itself, I've read all the transcripts, gone into all the details, and I side with Jo in general.

But even if I didn't think she was right, when Jo feels strongly about something you don't go against her. You just don't. That's certainly the way it is in my circle of Potter friends and also the way it is in Steve's (the two overlap a little, but I don't know Steve myself). I went through a long phase of feeling very sorry for him and wishing my friends would cut him some slack, but that's passed now. He's had plenty of chance to back out and he hasn't. So that's that.

I'll be civil to him as I would anyone, and I'd forgive him if he was truly sorry. But I won't pretend I have any of the respect and love for him I once had.

[bekkio]

Hi everyone,

Steve will no longer be joining us at Portus this summer, as announced in the April Portal. I know that many of you were unable to access that edition of the Portal due to our server issues.

Stay tuned for more details on programming at Portus!

Bekki

[Miss Freewind]

I am upset that Steve is no longer coming to Portus. I really loved his presentations at previous conferences. Though I'm not surprised he no longer wants to come because I have seen how nasty people are about this. I also think it is probably safer for him this way. I hope he will present at future conferences.:(

[TheSilverDoe]

But even if I didn't think she was right, when Jo feels strongly about something you don't go against her. You just don't. That's certainly the way it is in my circle of Potter friends and also the way it is in Steve's (the two overlap a little, but I don't know Steve myself).

I'm curious as to why this is. I mean, if you thought something was right, I'm fairly certain you should go with what you feel, in spite of what other people believe. I'd like to think that Jo would want you to go with what you think is right as well, even if she doesn't agree with you. But that being said, I don't think Steve started out "against" her in any way. Unfortunately it seems as if the whole thing just developed and escalated and he found himself on the opposite side of her. But it's really hard for any of us to know for sure what went on with either of them.

[David]

The same reason I don't go against my family a lot of the time. You love them and don't want to upset them.

If my actions would upset Jo, then because I love her so much, there's hardly anything that could make me go against her.

My dream is to have a book published, but I would never want that book to upset my hero and make her feel disappointed in me. It wouldn't be worth it, even if I thought Jo was wrong.

If I did feel Jo was wrong, I might want a chance to argue my point, but ultimately I would never have any intention of going ahead with something like that unless I could convince her to change her mind.